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  • Swallowbay - The content producer requests us to deactivate

theHobbit I’m not backtracking, I have no idea if it’s possible to start up your own independent site in the VR Porn space. Doublevr says that, since 2018, it’s not financially viable for new sites to work. I’m simply saying, if he is right, that’s pretty depressing.

If he is right then yes, you’re correct, it’s my own opinion that aggregator sites like SLR, POVR etc are the main cause of that. I have spoken to a VRporn site owner whose videos are on SLR and I asked him why he puts his stuff on here as that gives people zero incentive to subscribe to his site? He basically said that SLR have made it so that you have no choice, that you can’t operate on your own. He says that no one is prepared to subscribe to single studios anymore when these huge aggregator sites exist where you can get everything for one subscription. He therefore has to put the content on here to make it financially viable and the vicious circle continues then as that means no one subscribes to his site directly. Basically SLR has all the independent studios by the balls.

I don’t know if that is true either, maybe he’s just blaming others for his lack of success. It kind of makes sense to me though, what he’s saying, as why else is everyone putting all their content on here instead of keeping it exclusive to their own site?

I don’t blame SLR for doing what they do, it’s a business at the end of the day, they’re here to make money and, as far as VR porn goes, they’re pretty successful. As a consumer though I would appreciate a healthier VR porn scene with more smaller independent studios. In 2d porn there’s literally something for pretty much everyone, an almost infinite number of sites catering to every legal fetish. In VR, its pretty similar generic content being put out by a small number of studios.

      petermc He's not right though. A new site can easily succeed if they have a regular stream of reasonably good exclusive content. The only problem faced is getting some initial customers which means operating at a loss at first or building up a following on an aggregator site beforehand.

          petermc ok fair play but for the consumer though its a much better deal though right?

          I don't think anybody in their right mind would subscribe individually to multiple independent sites as the financial outlay would be far too much.

          I think what these smaller independent outfits should think is if they go down a separate subscription route they will probably end up encouraging higher rates of piracy of their content unfortunately. The aggregator sites in my view protect from piracy.

          I buy into SLR because of the aggregation but the biggest pull is SLRO.

          I buy into POVR because I get an aggregation and I get MILFVR, POVR and WANKZ. I want to cancel my POVR but I can't because I have too many favourites on their flagship sites that would mean I have to invest in some expensive SSD or a cloud service. On balance it is more cost effective to stick with POVR.

          Why on earth would I subscribe to VRBangers or Badoink. I would just do a mini month subscription, download what I like and then cancel. I like VRSpy but if they weren't on SLRO, I would just do a mini month sub for one month. If they limited downloads, then I would probably just not buy their service. However many people would get their product from other less ethical avenues if they did that. I just try to be more ethical about it as I think my financial outlay helps create the budget for some of the girls I want to see in VR/AR etc.

              Hairsational I don't think so, take VRSPY. Take RealJam - they blocked some exclusive content but the exclusive scenes have started to come across to the aggregators now.

              🙂 🙂 😃 - know you love my emojis lol

              Also some of you have been trying to persuade VRPlayful to do that. Talking about shooting yourself in your own foot lol. Most people will not follow them if they made that decision.

                theHobbit I don't think anybody in their right mind would subscribe individually to multiple independent sites as the financial outlay would be far too much.

                In 2d porn though they do and the industry is much healthier for it. People do subscribe to standalone sites like Brazzers or Evilangel or Tushy or Hardx and lots of smaller sites. There are aggregator sites there like Adult time but they’re not like SLR/POVR in that they don’t have everything by the sites they feature, just a select few scenes, usually pretty old ones. You have to subscribe to the actual site to see their whole catalogue and all their new stuff.

                You only have to look at how musicians struggle now that people just pay 9.99 a month to Apple Music and have access to pretty much every album they’d ever want rather than have to buy individual albums. They make little or no money on records now and have to tour constantly to stay afloat or need to have second jobs. Great for us perhaps but eventually it will just become not worth it for most bands (except the likes of Taylor Swift/Beyoncé) to make new music or at least put any great time or effort into it.

                I personally do subscribe to other sites like Realjam, Porncorn and sometimes SinsVR, even though I don’t need to as they put all their scenes on SLR. I do this as they shoot regular anal content and I want to financially support that so they continue to exist as it is so rare elsewhere. I also occasionally go to DarkroomVR, Virtual Taboo, CzechVR just when they build up a few scenes that I want to watch. I used to subscribe to Fuckpass too before they started on the Canon 8K camera and messed up their content.

                I think the issue you bring up with VRPlayful is that they seem to maybe want to push things a bit more hardcore and have indicated that they’re concerned about SLR’s super strict compliance (another troubling issue when one site has so much power, everyone else has to tailor their content to what SLR allow). They were worried they’d have to make cuts to their recent Veronica Leal scene but thankfully managed to get it through. The suggestion was that they’re not sure what they’re allowed to do or they may have gone a bit further with that scene.

                People (like me) were just suggesting that, rather than censor themselves, they could send an edited version to SLR which passes compliance and makes the scene financially viable but then find another avenue to release the uncut version and make a bit extra on the side. That could be their own site which, if it was successful, could eventually lead to them being able to go out on their own and stop giving scenes away on SLR.

                  4 days later

                  petermc

                  Starting your own website in 2023 is so incredibly easy, web-hosting is a lot more affordable now and CDNs are highly available to provide the fastest download speeds around the globe.

                  If they do not have enough customers then it's likely an issue with one of a few things imo:

                  • Price
                  • Not enough new videos
                  • Low quality videos <-- so many studios!
                  • Marketing

                  Buying access to an aggregator like SLR is great for customers, not only financially but having the choice of content - discovering studios you never knew existed.

                      The big problem with starting a new paysite now is you don't have the massive catalog that other sites have built up over the past 5+ years. You can't fund productions on a promise, so you have to host your portfolio on aggregator sites to cover ongoing costs. The reason there are so many 2d studios is because making 2d is way cheaper and easier. You can shoot that shit on your phone.

                        vrpicasso Unless it's 2017, launching any new paysite in VR it's nowhere good idea.

                        Source: first hand knowledge of paysites sales numbers.

                        You simply can't compete with SLR and current content propostion is oversaturated.

                          jommy I think it’s easier in standard porn where you just need a mobile phone with a camera and you’re ready to go. You’ve also got a much larger (almost infinite) number of people that can access your content.

                          I think in VR, there’s probably a significant outlay to get all the correct equipment and then a period of learning how to use it to get decent results on scaling, distances etc. Then you have to pay the talent as you probably aren’t going to get too much content trade on VR scenes as the girl can’t just put it on her Onlyfans page. There’s also a very limited number of VR porn users.

                          I think, unless you’re independently wealthy or backed by a third party (like how xhamster back Virtualtaboo and Darkroom), most feel they have to use a SLR type site to generate returns from their scenes, at least early on. It’s then a question of whether they can entice people to want to pay a separate subscription for their content alone. Why would people do that though when all your scenes are included in SLR for no added cost?

                          You’re seeing Realjam now waiting much longer to put their scenes on the aggregator sites. It used to be about 4 days from the scene appearing on their site to appearing on SLR. Now it’s much longer, probably closer to a month. That might be the first step but their scenes all end up here eventually if you’re prepared to wait. I think the next step is to start making some scenes with top stars exclusive to entice people over. You then have to hope you’ve built enough of a membership to sustain you and break away altogether. Like I said though, there’s not many potential VR porn customers to go around and a lot just don’t seem to want to have multiple subscriptions. They have been conditioned to expect pay one subscription for a ton of content rather than pay the same money for maybe a couple of scenes per week.

                              theHobbit I don't think anybody in their right mind would subscribe individually to multiple independent sites

                              theHobbit Why on earth would I subscribe to VRBangers or Badoink

                              well once again, I could not possibly agree with you less. I do sub to Bangers, Badoink, RealJam, 18VR, VirtualTaboo, Stripz… and Wankz, POVR, and the new sites, PornCorn and VRSpy… whether their content lands over here or not, I gladly pay them for what they’re doing. Am I in my right mind to do this? Maybe, maybe not. What the fuck difference does that make?

                              The reason I do is because I’m all for as much competition as possible to sites like this that in their arrogance try to assimilate everything else and dictate what we can and can’t see. I hope one by one all third party sites manage to break free from the grasp of SLR. Once again I don’t often agree with @petermc but he’s right when he says the grip SLR has on VR right now is unhealthy. Let there be competition. The more the better for we as consumers.

                                    argyle43 Am I in my right mind to do this?

                                    No.

                                    However if you can afford it then plough your money into duplicate content lol, some people are a bit wiser than that with their cash. Like with all the money you are saving you could probably have the vision pro pay for itself after a couple of years.

                                        argyle43 Wow, and I thought I was hardcore with a SLR + scripts, POVR and the occasional other site

                                          petermc

                                          Yeah for sure the VR requirements for hardware and filming technique is much higher than 2D so not for everyone. Imo it's only worth filming VR if it's done to a high standard - otherwise it's better to stick with 2D videos.

                                          I think SLR use ZCamK2 Pro camera which is $6k new so imo it's not super super out of reach for small studios, finance/loan should be possible right?

                                          I've seen a bunch of smaller studios that would have had amazing content if it were in better quality, for example..
                                          https://www.sexlikereal.com/studios/blush-erotica
                                          https://www.sexlikereal.com/studios/peeping-thom

                                          I can see both sides of the aggregator argument tbh, SLR being an aggregator can feel like it's stifling competition but on the other hand, it allows small studios to grow as they don't need to invest in their own website/billing system etc. They simply upload the videos and SLR take care of everything else.

                                          Customers only have so much money to spend each month on porn, so it's unrealistic to expect people to sub to many sites.

                                          Studios delaying SLR uploads is one tactic to try and encourage people subbing to their own website and kind of smart.

                                          At the end of the day i'd say it's definitely a win for customers and small studios that aggregator websites exist so long as they offer fair and transparent payouts to studios.

                                          Also, if a studio has their own website then they are not bound by certain content rules (incest for example) that SLR must abide by due to payment processor rules, we all know how popular incest is in porn, that's a giant niche that seems untapped in VR.

                                              argyle43 Once again I don’t often agree with @petermc but he’s right when he says the grip SLR has on VR right now is unhealthy. Let there be competition. The more the better for we as consumers.

                                              Careful now! We’re getting dangerously close to being best friends 🤣🤣.

                                              I’m pleased though that you also subscribe to other sites. We all should support the content we enjoy if we can afford to do so or we could lose it.

                                                jommy agreed, it’s not all bad. I’m sure SLR are a help to small independent studios starting out. It’s just a shame that the VR Porn industry and customer base doesn’t seem to be able to support many of those studios to ever feel financially secure enough to leave the nest and go out on their own. If we have reached a point that new sites are not possible, as was suggested, that is not a healthy state of affairs in my opinion, certainly not something to crow about as DoubleVR seemed to be.

                                                I think the fact that none of the major porn producers followed Naughty America into VR probably speaks volumes for how difficult it is to make it work financially. If Brazzers, Evil Angel and their ilk don’t feel there’s money in it, what hope a small outfit starting from scratch?

                                                  theHobbit every bit as much as you imagine… and worth every last penny to me. Independent producers, lots of them, and a liquid market with plenty of competition is good for all of us. Giant monopolistic Borg-like behemoths dominating the landscape, yea, not so good.

                                                      argyle43 what's your financial outlay each year with all those sites?

                                                      Understand your justification. What's the yearly financial outlay you are spending on VR porn?

                                                      If you are shy or hesitant to say lol, please provide instead what percentage of your monthly income is spent on supporting VR porn. Shouldn't be to hard to quantify that.